Yesterday (Thursday) morning, another instructor and student were killed at Sheppard AFB in yet another training accident….
WICHITA FALLS, Texas (AP) — The Air Force says it has grounded all T-38C training jets following the second fatal crash involving the aircraft in eight days.
Military authorities say two pilots died early Thursday when their high-altitude, supersonic jet crashed at Sheppard Air Force base in northern Texas.
A public affairs spokeswoman says the plane was assigned to the 80th Flying Training Wing, which trains combat pilots for NATO.
Two pilots died April 23 when their training jet crashed at Columbus Air Force Base in Mississippi.
The Air Force has suspended all T-38 flights pending investigations into what caused both crashes.
82nd Training Wing Public Affairs
5/2/2008 - SHEPPARD AIR FORCE BASE, Texas — Sheppard officials have identified the pilots killed during a May 1 training mission.
Maj. Brad Funk, 35, a 90th Flying Training Squadron instructor pilot, and 2nd Lt. Alec Littler, 23, a student pilot in the 80th Flying Training Wing’s Euro-NATO Joint Jet Pilot Training program, died when their aircraft crashed on approach during a training mission at about 7:55 a.m.
A memorial service will be held for the victims at 10 a.m. May 5 in Hangar 2408.
An investigation board is currently working to determine the cause of the accident. Anyone who witnessed the crash, or has any photographs or video of the events before, during or after the accident, please call the 80th FTW at (940) 676-1601.
Because of the accident, the military flight operations have been suspended until further notice. Civilian air traffic resumed normal operations today.
More information will be released as it becomes available.
Maj. Funk and Lt. Littler, God Bless your families as they grieve their loss. Requiescat In Pace.
It is not easy for a training command to suffer one tragedy, much less two in such an extremely short amount of time. It is not combat, but training these students to become future fighter pilots is not exactly the safest of endeavors, but a fulfilling one to be sure.
I know that they both occured supposedly during a critical phase of flight, with this last one during the landing phase… there’s never a good time for a problem during flight… but it is definitely not a good time when terra firma is so close and you’re moving at 175+ knots approach/landing speed ( pretty slow for a T-38). While they’ve got the 38s grounded, I surely hope that they find out what has caused these two crashes. We can ill afford to lose more brave warriors, much less to training accidents…
Don't Mess With Me.
When I joined the Air Force in 1981, I was assigned as a crew chief on the F-106. The F-106 was produced in the late 50s and was taken out of service, to be used as drones, in the late 80’s. Why am I saying this? The T-38 (F-5) was produced at the same time.
It’s time to get these aircraft out of our inventory.
Robert,
Many of the T-38s on the line are indeed ‘68-’69 models. They have recently updated the avionics and the engines on them. That being said, they still cost ALOT to operate, atleast when compared to the T-6 II. There are plans being considered to draw down the amount of initial undergraduate pilot training performed in the T-38 and the T-1 and focus more of it in the T-6. While I am not sure this is necessarily a good idea, it is more of a $$$ issue than a mechanical safety issue. I am doubting that it was a mechanical issue given the track record of maintenance and the experiences of the T-38 (everything bad that can be found in that aircraft has had 40+ years to be found, like the venerable T-37), but I am not saying it wasn’t, given the fact the new engines have been installed. I am reserving my judgement until the accident boards meet and figure out what happened….
This is such a tragedy for the families of the two pilots. My son is one of the student pilots in the 80th Flying Training Wing ENJJPT, so this has hit me very hard. My heart goes out especially to the mothers of these brave, bright, and brilliant young men.
I am trying to learn all I can about the T38C, and have been concerned about the age of these jets.
The T-38 is a lot of jet for any student to handle and it is very unforgiving. I think an important step to improving the safety is to update the ejection seats. The T-6 has the sweet 0/0 seats capable of punching someone clear at 0 airspeed and 0 AGL alt. The T-38 seats have a much more restrictive envelope and the pilots still carry parachutes on their back which means longer opening times. Of course, I do not know if ejection was attempted in either of these cases.
Phil,
I heard, initially, that there was an attempted ejection in the Shepperd accident. The T-37, of which I was an instructor in, was unforgiving of students in its own way (uber-long spin up time of engine), and its ejection seat was even worse than that of the T-38, which I believe was still a 60/0, or 0/60 seat. I am defending the T-38 perhaps too much, but I just have a feeling that this is not a mechanical problem, though I have no proof of such a claim, just a gut feeling. We’ll have to wait for the accident boards to meet and make their assessments of what exactly happened. There are way too many factors in the error chain to try to pin down an exact cause without the investigation.
Can we bet there will be a Congressional investigation into this?
It’s sad because it doesn’t happen that often. People just assume flying is safe- any form of flying in any plane. It’s not always true.
How sad for the families of these men. Bless them.
It makes me so terribly sad…..I knew this family for a short time and they are a beautiful bunch….All of my prayers are with them…
Duncan,
Do you think the restrictive visibility for the instructor in the back of the 38 is a potential liability as well.
Phil,
I flew the T-37 as an instructor, and it is a side-by-side set-up, and then transitioned to the T-6, a tandem set-up like the T-38. And yep, I found it more difficult to instruct, see, etc. I said more difficult, but not impossible, and I had become used to instructing with many more visual cues available, so the tandem made me work a little harder and less of a fan. All that aside, in my opinion, while the tandem seating is definitely not an asset for instruction, it is not so great a liability as to create a unsafe situation. They’ve been instructing in the T-38 and the T-34 for along time. An attentive instructor who does not allow himself to become distracted or complacent can eliminate most liability created from the tandem seating arrangement.
Hey guys… Let’s wait for the accident report before we ge too carried away. I was a T-38 IP at Vance from ‘97 to 2000 and I have about 1050 hours in the jet. over 700 of those hours are instructor time. I also have over 1000 hours in the F-15C of which over 300 are instructor time. I met Major Brad “Gyro” Funk in 2004 when we were both upgrading to become F-15C IPs in the 1st fighter squadron (fight’n furies). You will never meet a greater Father, Husband, Officer, Pilot, American, or friend. There will always be training accidents as long as man is willing to test the limits of physics to reach for the skies. It just hits a lot closer to home when its your friend. Here’s to Gyro… Rest in peace my brother.
Grit
Grit,
I agree that everything we say is just a bunch of wild-ass speculation and that the investigation will shine the light on what occurred and how we can try to prevent it in the future. I am sorry for the loss of your friend and squadron mate. He is a Patriot and without men like him, our country would indeed be in sorry shape.
Funk was an amazing individual and great friend. I met Funk while at Tyndall as a student. The AF has lost a wonderful officer, leader, mentor and friend. My prayers are with the family, especially his wife and kids. Being a fighter pilot’s wife myself and a fellow officer, this really hits home. “Jimmie” will be greatly missed.
I have heard that the T38’s at Sheppard may be back up again for pilot training as early as next Monday. Has anyone heard anything about the grounding of the T38’s coming to an end? How does one find out about the status of the investigation?