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Why should women give up their orgasms for a man?
Posted by Raven on January 3rd, 2009
Oh good grief. I might get into trouble for this post.
There’s a little buzz going on in the blogosphere about Dennis Prager’s column on married couples and sex..or the lack of it. It’s all about wives not being in the mood. He wrote two articles on this.
The subject is one of the most common problems that besets marriages: the wife who is “not in the mood” and the consequently frustrated and hurt husband.
There are marriages with the opposite problem — a wife who is frustrated and hurt because her husband is rarely in the mood. But, as important and as destructive as that problem is, it has different causes and different solutions, and is therefore not addressed here. What is addressed is the far more common problem of “He wants, she doesn’t want.”
There’s different kinds of sex. And different expectations. We have women who either like it, or they don’t. I blame the MAN when the woman doesn’t LIKE IT.
First, women need to recognize how a man understands a wife’s refusal to have sex with him: A husband knows that his wife loves him first and foremost by her willingness to give her body to him. This is rarely the case for women. Few women know their husband loves them because he gives her his body (the idea sounds almost funny).
Men want companionship and all that comes with it. This can be sex, talking, working out together at the gym, doing house errands, being with the kids…men aren’t just out for sex in spite of what they say. I know far more married guys who are unhappy because of the lack of companionship, and not because of a lack of sex. I sometimes think, men would be much happier if they could be married to one woman, and be “allowed” to sex it up with others. But I also know many women who would like the same.
This is a major reason many husbands clam up. A man whose wife frequently denies him sex will first be hurt, then sad, then angry, then quiet. And most men will never tell their wives why they have become quiet and distant. They are afraid to tell their wives. They are often made to feel ashamed of their male sexual nature, and they are humiliated (indeed emasculated) by feeling that they are reduced to having to beg for sex.
Men clam up cause they’re men. They have this ego thing going, all the time. When they clam up, they shut out their wives. We all know this. Men know, when they have to beg for sex, that they either suck at it, or they don’t want to put forth any effort. That’s tough on the ego. It doesn’t take a scientist to figure this all out.
One of life’s lessons I’ve learned:
Women who enjoy sex will want it. No matter what. In order for women to enjoy sex, men have to skilled lovers.
It’s that simple.
And that complicated. Women don’t always want to tell their husbands they are bored with sex….that it doesn’t feel good nor is pleasing…it indeed becomes a chore, a duty. Wives don’t want to hurt their husbands feelings, and, their ego.
…Compared to most women’s sexual nature, men’s sexual nature is far closer to that of animals. So what? That is the way he is made. Blame God and nature. Telling your husband to control it is a fine idea. But he already does. Every man who is sexually faithful to his wife already engages in daily heroic self-control. He has married knowing he will have to deny his sexual nature’s desire for variety for the rest of his life. To ask that he also regularly deny himself sex with the one woman in the world with whom he is permitted sex is asking far too much. Deny him enough times and he may try to fill this need with another woman. If he is too moral to ever do that, he will match your sexual withdrawal with emotional and other forms of withdrawal.
The threat of infidelity. It’s always there. And it’s a great way to keep a marriage together eh?
But it’s absolute non sense. This I know. I’ve seen first hand, what men will do for sex, and how much they will pay for it…the fantasy, the lure, the need for different women…the so called desire for young girls…virgins…I’ve seen married men cheat on their wives for no “reason” other than they want to. It’s not a need so much as it’s a right, to many men.
Men are animals. But so are women. Again, women who enjoy sex will want it, ask for it, expect it, and DO IT. Often. Without reserve. Without strings. Women who like sex see men differently than those who don’t. Every male is scrutinized for his sexual potential; his body gets more than a double glance; his presence sets off hormone production in women. The chemistry takes over and the attraction is there. Women have to fight these feelings and urges as well, if they’re sexually in tune with their bodies. Sure, they tend to see a romantic and lovey dovey side to men, but they also are capable to seeing the sexual object in them.
Could it be, God forbid, that she wants more than a four minute flat tumble in the sack, after which he turns over and fast falls asleep, snoring?? Might she be more apt to mood up, if she got something out of it? Might her needs be considered as well?
It’s funny how Prager refuses to examine this.
There’s a time and place for quickies, in every relationship. Yes, women often get little from these fast moving fun times. They work well when little kids’ bedtime isn’t for hours or when time alone isn’t possible…but they should always be part of a much bigger, longer lasting encounter that both know is coming…..and anticipating. And wanting. Desiring.
When these “married people-quickies” become the norm in a relationship though, boredom will quickly settle in. Most women have to work hard to get in the mood. Men don’t. It’s easy to get trapped into this sexual lifestyle. It seems to me Mr. Prager is promoting this selfish and unfulfilling “MarriedPeopleSex” lifestyle….it’s the wives duty to give her body to her husband no matter what. He tells women to ignore their moods and fulfill their obligations. Oh my.
Then he blames women’s lib movement- which is totally not relevant in the minds of modern women.
We have been nurtured in a culture of rights, not a culture of obligations. To many women, especially among the best educated, the notion that a woman owes her husband sex seems absurd, if not actually immoral. They have been taught that such a sense of obligation renders her “property.” Of course, the very fact that she can always say “no” — and that this “no” must be honored — renders the “property” argument absurd. A woman is not “property” when she feels she owes her husband conjugal relations. She is simply wise enough to recognize that marriages based on mutual obligations — as opposed to rights alone and certainly as opposed to moods — are likely to be the best marriages.
Mind over mood.
Sure. Is this a way to prevent wives from liking sex? So, they won’t ever KNOW what they’re missing? Let’s move women back to the 50’s when they knew where their place was, and what their duties were.
A woman who actually likes sex changes things. And might even be a threat. Because she can seek sex elsewhere, as well, when she is bored with the Sex’n'Snore routine Mr. Prager is recommending.
Did the 60’s show women that sex is good? That it feels awesome? That the right skills from the right man, at the right time, is something worth striving for?
I dunno. I wasn’t part of that movement, as it’s called. I do know that sex is good; that I expect it to be a mutually satisfying experience and that this is the obligation of both husbands and wives- men and women living together– towards each other. Not just one way.
Newsflash:::::
WOMEN HAVE HAD A FEW REALLY GOOD ORGASMS. We know what we want. We know we might have to teach our men some new tricks…to get what we want. WE’RE NOT going to ever stop wanting (and expecting) good sex. Sorry guys. The female animal was unleashed and she’s too strong and independent now to go back to captivity.
Many contemporary women have an almost exclusively romantic notion of sex: It should always be mutually desired and equally satisfying or one should not engage in it. Therefore, if a couple engages in sexual relations when he wants it and she does not, the act is “dehumanizing” and “mechanical.”
Damn right. Why should women give up their orgasms for a man? And, I have to ask, what man would ASK his woman to do that??????
Moods notwithstanding…did it ever occur to Mr. Prager that changing that mood might be worth it? Oh wait…that might require some work on the mans’ part. Can’t have that now can we??
It’s gotta be tough to be a man, isn’t it Dennis? It’s tough to know you’re expected to do more than ask, or as you like to say, beg. It’s gotta be tough to know that women have some expectations; that we don’t want to just spread the legs and let you go at it…all the time, with nothing in it for us. That a quick romp isn’t good enough, for some of us. That some effort might be called for, to please us.
When a man provides an awesome sexual experience for a woman, you can bet your ass she will pony up and ride irregardless of her moods!
I don’t like to bash men. I love men, and I think I know a little more about them then most people realize. Smart men know they have to create the mood; that they have to put aside their own needs, at first, in order to get their women to satisfy THOSE NEEDS. Smart men know that really good, really hot sex takes TWO- and they respect the fact that a sexually aroused woman is the biggest turn on of them all. Not the woman who is simply doing her duty.
January 3rd, 2009 at 1:58 pm
:bigslurp:
If men suck in bed, someone need to teach, tell them what they need to change. Feedback is very critical and needs to be done in the correct way. Everyone could use some good feedback, not criticism just feedback, what works,If sex is good for both then it will not be withheld. if the guy quivers and then fall asleep they need to know that is not acceptable. Same thing for a woman. That is called communication.
What did you learn in school today? Shaaaaaaaaring
January 3rd, 2009 at 2:58 pm
Um… women have orgasms??
:bigdizzy:
January 3rd, 2009 at 3:13 pm
Michael you’re right. It takes two- and they need to communicate. There’s a way to do that which doesn’t leave the other feeling inept.
Sex’n'Snoring has IT’s PLACE too- women are guilty of doing this as well….”Just get it over dear” comes to mind…that’s not acceptable either.
It pisses me off to read articles like these written by Mr. Prager. It would be ONE thing if he suggested a once-in-awhile sacrifice of one sided sex…but he’s not. In my mind, he is asking women to give up their own sexual needs to save men from having to participate and be active lovers. To that I say, Bullfuckingshit. LOL And no thanks…a world without sex is bleak indeed.
Micheal let’s take a bath?
:bigbth:
January 3rd, 2009 at 3:14 pm
Duncan needs some lessons. Heh. Where to begin???
January 4th, 2009 at 11:57 pm
To what he said -in your mind-, you say bullfuckingshit. What he wrote in the column is a different thing. You’re doing that “in other words…” thing that… difficult people do so often. Like “you should be nice to people” “So what you’re saying is, I should eat shit”.
Guys who put ZERO effort into sex aren’t really that common. Maybe 10% of bad sex is caused by that. 40% is caused by the woman thinking her sole contribution is to lie there passively judging the man’s performance like it would be undignified to move a little, the other %50 is caused by the guy just not getting any freaking practice because whenever he says that it would be appropriate to have sex with your spouse fairly often, somehow she hears “Rape is cool” or “I’m trying to STEAL THE ORGASMS FROM YOUR MAGIC BAG”.
January 5th, 2009 at 6:03 am
Dave,
You’re talking about that rut a couple get into. I mentioned it. It can become a vicious cycle. How to fix it? How does a man learn when he’s never given the opportunity? There’s books and videos (not porn)and ofcourse, magazines.
I also mentioned that quickies have a time and place– and almost always do little for the woman.
And for your info, when a woman MOVES it does not do much for her; in fact it does nothing. So the argument of lying there, moving is totally void. It’s not that easy dude. Like it or not, the guy has to do some work if he wants his lady to be satisfied.
January 5th, 2009 at 2:33 pm
Michael started this off well. I think if we all owrk together for the betterment of the sex we have, everyone will enjoy it more because everyone will get what they are looking for. A woman needs to talk to her man about it in the right way and vice versa. Make it good for both parties and all the BS goes away. What happened to works and plays well with others being part of a relationship – it’s kindergarten level.
January 5th, 2009 at 7:56 pm
Primarily, I’m talking about your objections to things that Prager did NOT say. The title of your post, for example, is a straw man which implies that Prager said “women should give up their orgasms”, when what he said is more accurately summarized as “women should have sex with thier husbads”. You might be able to make a good case that temporarily witholding sex is an indispensible tool in the effort to improve one’s sex life and have more orgasms later on, in which case, in a way, if someone threw that tool away, they’d be “giving up their orgasms”, but you have not made that case, you just seem to be taking it as a given that “you should consider putting out even if you aren’t actually super-horny RIGHT NOW” = “You shouln’t have orgasms”. I am not disagreeing with your opinions or preferences about sex, I am objecting to your misrepresentation of the intentions behind another person’s statements.
Hail Goldstein 
My comment seems a bit spammy, so I’m going to try breaking it up.
January 5th, 2009 at 7:57 pm
RE: Moving. I am almost POSITIVE that for at least some women, rubbing their crotch up against someone who loves them does SOMETHING for them. If necrophillia role play works better for you, that is great (not sarcasm). Different stuff feels good to different people. No offence, but women are fucking retards with no natural capacity for empathy at all, so they tend to assume that everyone is exactly the same. If they need to get choked to have an orgasm, then all of the non-choking people are anti-orgasm, there’s no possiblity of people getting to orgasm in different ways. I’m afraid that this last paragraph might sound personal, hostile etc, but you DID just do the exact same thing to me that you did in the original post. I said that the woman ought to put in some effort as well as the man, and you said that the man has to put in some effort (sorry), as if I’d said that the man SHOULD NOT have to put any effort in. Is this what it’s come to, I say that maybe when two people have sex with each other, they should BOTH try moving a little, and now I’M trying to steal the orgasms from your magic bag too?
IMO, practically the only good that comes from having comments on a blog is that people can let you know when, in trying to come up with something to say about everything, we occassionally, perhaps inevitably (given Man’s fallen nature) begin to pick up certain Democrat-like habits of thought.
January 5th, 2009 at 9:17 pm
Well Dave, if this is all it takes for you to be satisfied, so be it. A woman who puts out, lays there and moves is good for some. Way back in my life, when I was a high paid child prostitute, these were the words of advice we young girls were given: Move and Moan. Men love it and it makes them feel like MEN. (And since they’re paying for it, we best fake it to the max!)
Whatever. The point I was trying to make in my post was my opinion that Prager is encouraging women to indeed have sex, with their husbands, no matter what their mood. A loving and good wife will put out with no regard for her own needs and wants- and this all sounds good. Eventually, she gets BORED though. She no longer has any interest in in just lying there, moving faking it up to the max just so it can be said, she’s a WISE WOMAN.
Newsflash::::
Women will get bored. Sex will become a duty. An obligation. An act. The marriage will enter a period that many call a RUT. This is a problem. Many women will seek sexual companionship elsewhere. They get cold and unloving towards the man they are married to. They start rejecting any attempts to move sex into another realm. Hate to say it, but once a woman becomes bored with her husband, it will take one hell of a lot of hard work on his part, to change that. It takes a special man to fix it all- and one who is willing to dedicate much. In exchange though, he will get much in return. Sexually and otherwise.
Prager is encouraging women to stop being selfish (with wanting/expecting their own orgasms); he is blaming another generation for all this (he needs to get with the times and stop living in the distant past); he is promoting the groundwork that leads to broken marriages. His advice may have been relevant 20 or 30 or 40 or 50 yrs ago- but not now.
Women want their orgasms. If their guy isn’t willing to BRING THAT MOOD UP by going down on her, he deserves what he gets. As I said, I believe an aroused woman is much preferred than a duty driven woman.
January 5th, 2009 at 9:22 pm
Oh and Dave puleeze stop it with the argument that I must be liberal to hold the opinions I hold.
Just because a woman likes, wants and expects orgasms doesn’t make her liberal. It makes her wise. Yes- sorry about that buddy. It means a guy will have to work hard to please me…but damn what he gets back is more than worth it.
:fu: